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The music industrys most in-demand are ripping the plastic off a new package ofSettlers of Catan.
It puts you back in touch with how the country has gone this way, he jokes.
The music industry is a similar game, and one these guys are less interested in playing.
They made a lot of the songs for their self-titled album (out this week) here.
Its not the work of a group of Napoleons seeking to take over the landscape with a tried formula.
L.A.s Sounwave is most renowned as part of the TDE family, and has worked extensively with Kendrick Lamar.
Chicagos Dew co-wrote Swift and Zayns hit I Dont Wanna Live Forever.
They humor each others inner nerds and indulge each others nostalgic obsessions.
The verdict: Theyre both great.
Theres this Garden of Eden world and then theres this bizarre merry-go-round.
At different points each of us has had a moment of seeing how the latter works.
You get thrown in different rooms and you go, Screw this.
The impression is that the three of us do a ton of different stuff.
Its not that true.
You have specific people you work with.
Its so rare to meet new people.
I met these guys because Id heard a lot from people I trust.
Sam: Its true.
Jack: And it can kill you.
I like the idea of making something with a group of friends.
If you put on this record you hear the three of us.
People are starting to get really smart to that.
How was my cereal made?
How was my pasta made?
How was my record made?
Whats in this thing?!
Sometimes you get a lot of collaborators, but this record three people made it.
How could you know?
All you could talk about is what you dont wanna do.
Its like when you go to a restaurant and they ask if you have any allergies.
Then theres this wonder of what youre gonna get.
Its not negative but its so much cooler to say what youre not into.
Sam:Thats why I liked writing on this project.
Its not trying to say any buzzwords.
Theres a lot of lines that youve heard a lot on the radio right now.
And I attribute half of that to Jack because hes just so honest.
Jack: I woulda fucked some of the songs up if I were alone.
I wouldve been like, You cant just say that, you gotta subvert it.
I make the weirdest sounds and have a go at bring it back down to reality.
And sometimes I feel like it could betooweird.
When you have collaborators who wanna be on that same journey and are trying to bend rules?
Theres the capacity for so many shortcuts making music today.Sam:They work!
Jack: It depends what youre after.
They work for a version of success.
Thats the devil out here, you have to be careful of it.
People will tell you youre doing good.
Theres a wide line between what brings in a lot of money versus what people love.
They probably didnt chart that high but they live forever.
Look at Robyns Dancing On My Own.
The most important pop song of this generation never touched radio the way other stuff did.
So its cool to be out here and find other people who are also dodging.
L.A. is about protection.
My advice to any artist or writer is come out here and get your armor on.
These guys are my armor.
Get a group of people who know you.
Dont let anyone else in the door.
What are some of the things youre trying to dodge?Jack: The shit everyone says.
Sounwave: Being in a comfort zone makes me uncomfortable.
Youve never heard a sound like this.
Its a new language.
You get good at something because you came from your own culture.
You came up with your friends.
People start to like you because of what you did in your garage or basement.
But shouldnt you just tell me to do whatever the fuck I want?
Isnt that the lesson?
And its not cynical.
No ones trying to hurt you.
Sam: Thats the scariest thing about it.
Everyones on your team.
The answer is: No one fucking knows.
Let the artist sit there until they say its good.
But they like to pull this with all of us: Go work with this person because theymakeit good.
They dont make it good.
You either have a vibe or you dont.
I was like, What did you say?
In life you just look for those moments of,I havent heard that before.
That parts not rocket science.
If it makes your eyebrows stand up cool.
Sam: Sometimes youre more tapped into energy than you think.
Sounwave: Im extremely tapped in.
I have a girlfriend who is 100 percent tapped in, so Im like 50 percent.
My third eye is open.
Are you all astrologically aligned?
Jack: I didnt grow up big on astrology.
Maybe its a Jewish thing: Youre miserable cause youre miserable.
Do you fuck with it, Sam?
Your tattoos would suggest a level of mysticism to me.
Maybe thats just the owl staring at me.
note: Dew has an owl tattoo on his left bicep.]
Sam: Youre the first person to nail it!
Its the barn owl from season one.
Jack: I cant believe you have aTwin Peakstattoo.
Which tattoo do you totally regret?
Sam:[Points next to the owl] The Radiohead scary bear.
I was stanning a little too hard.
At that point in my life it was Radiohead andAssassins Creedvideo games.
Jack: That makes it cooler.
Radiohead on its own is one thing.
You put Radiohead,Assassins Creed, andTwin Peaksall in one bicep.
It starts to create the makeup of a divine being.
Sounwave:Have you heard of this [astrology] app called the Pattern?
Jack: All my apps bring me food.
And Tetris, man.
I am crushing right now.
Is the Pattern religious?
Has it ever led you to a bad place?
Sounwave:No, everythings positive.
Its never like, Youre gonna die.
Jack: What are you listening to right now?
Clairo, Weyes Blood, and Bon Iver.
How doesJustin Vernon get better every time?
I dont know where the peak is.Jack: Hopefully you never find out.
Isnt that the worst?
Thats whats so crazy about this work.
Anyone who wants to tell you its endless is wrong.
If you feel something, make it.
If you love it, check that its right.
Theres a way you’ve got the option to do it thats the best.
For this work, the highest form of it is to love what you do and believe it.
Theres a lot of space out there and you shouldnt take it up for no reason.
So if you believe it, proudly take up a little space.
If you dont, go home until its right.
They prove it over and over.
Who is worthy of taking up space right now?Sam: Kendrick Lamar.
Jack: Everything that comes out of Sounwaves world.
If it has that stamp on it you know you should listen.
That reminds me of growing up.
Whether it was Merge records, or Sub Pop.
TDE is the new Sub Pop.
If I see those letters Im gonna listen.
Sam: When I was 23 I was listening to a lot of Danger Mouse.
Thats when I first discovered I had a taste based off producers.
I follow my favorite producers.
Who are they?Sam: Two of them are right here.
Also, [DJ] Dahi and Pharrell.
Jack: Pharrells the best.
Hes always throwing around wisdom.
You run into him and hell just fire something great at you.
Itll make your day.
Hes my version of the Pattern.
Hes just shouting poetry.
Sam: He did that to me the one time we had a real sit-down.
He told me I reminded him of himself and that I should stop giving away all my hits.
Sounwave: The last time I talked to Pharrell he hit me with a gem.
We were talking about our kids I have a 1-year-old now.
He said one simple line: Your son is the greatest thing youve ever produced.
That stuck with me.
Its like the first time you go from the McDonalds burger to a sick burger.
Youve just been doing it weird?
You hear that all the time.
Theres nothing wrong with pop music.
Theres some weird stuff going on.
Sounwave: I was pleasantly surprised by Childish Gambinos Redbone.
Its so not normal but it worked on the radio.
Its so funny because people just want the next thing.
Remember when trap was a weird, underground art form?
Sam: I remember when Waka Flocka Flame first came out.
I heard it at a pizza place before it blew up.
It was all through Atlanta.
People were like, Yo, this is the future!
And I was like, Trust me.
It still took three or four years [to catch on].
Jack: In a weird way emo didnt happen till trap emo.
The level of which emo culture has now influenced this younger culture of hip-hop is a crazy cycle.
I think its the same shit as always with the conversation around genre.
You turned on the radio, youd hear Salt-N-Pepa into Melissa Etheridge into Weezer into Weird Al.
I grew up in a time where I didnt care [about genre].
When someone says, Its all about singles right now.
Um, remember the 50s?
Its the same shit.
You got people who got these random-ass songs that people love and they dont care about the artist.
You got people who make albums.
Its always the same thing.
Sam: Theres always gonna be art to fit culture, and art to suggest it.
And anybody who tells you that albums are dead is because they make money off singles.
Name the ten best artists alive?
A song is a thought.
you’re free to write a million songs but not an album.
Same reason if you put on a playlist, why isnt it an album?
But you listen to Fleetwood MacsTuskor Snoop DoggsDoggystyle.
Its just a feeling.
Why is WilcosYankee Hotel Foxtrotso good?
Why is it sometimes you see a movie and youre like, Thats not a movie.
An album just is or it isnt.
You know when you hear it.
This interview has been edited and condensed.
