After decades onscreen, nothing surprises theWestworldactress, though what shes ready to share will surprise you.
Save this article to read it later.
Find this story in your accountsSaved for Latersection.
Emmy Insider
The Emmy race has begun!
Vulture is taking a close look at the contenders until nomination-round voting closes on July 13.
Not because shes shy, but because shes waiting for the right moment.
So careful what you do, everybody, she says.
She might turn out to be Thandie Newton.
Shes unsparing about her own career choices and yet maintains the wisdom and compassion to forgive herself.
We got to press on, havent we, my love?
Are you in your bedroom right now?I am.
Its very hard to find a quiet spot.
We currently have my family in isolation.
I was loving it, but also willing its end because it was that demanding.
And Id come off 12 months of pretty intense work withWestworld.
InWestworld,your performance isso poignant, both ferocious and beautiful.
I do have frustrations with Maeve, but thats part of her story line.
Im not surprised that it hooked people in.
And then the second and third season has Maeve with a different directive, but its not her own.
Shes following other peoples leads, by and large.
In the first season, she was driving, dominating, pretty straightforward.
She certainly doesnt want to.
When did things shift?I think its hugely to do with my ethnicity.
I had no sense of myself.
One of the reasons why is because I was not considered anything.
There was a lot that people could have been interested in in me when I was young.
They didnt want to express it, because they didnt want to praise the Black girl.
I had this dance teacher, cause ballet was my thing.
I came from a very small town.
We didnt have capoeira and this and that.
Not even like jazz or fucking modern that would have been way too ghetto.
Year after year, I was a star student.
Id always be given the solo to make the school look good.
She would give this ceramic ballet dancer, like a little kind of Oscar.
It was screamingly obvious that I should have been given prizes.
I didnt even think about it.
Because, look, this all instilled in me a work ethic and perfectionism.
Its not pride in my work or pride in the perfectionism.
Because she was so proud of me, she wanted to compensate.
We didnt talk about it at the time, but the damage was so done.
It just made me super-vulnerable to predators.
Because theres so much about not having a sense of my value.
I suffered quite badly for a couple of years from anorexia, and it all feeds into this.
Just wanting to disappear.
What happened for me was I had a very complicated relationship with …
I let other people do the choosing for me.
What were you going to say?
That you had a complicated relationship with … ?With sexual relationships.
It was like I had to give something back for being noticed.
You get predators and sexual abusers, they can smell it a mile off.
Its like a shark smelling blood in the water.
All you need is one of those to really drive you into the dust.
In a way, an eating disorder was just like,Okay, I need to finish myself off.
Afterward, I saw her as she came into the pub and we chatted.
I found myself telling her my story about being sexually abused.
She didnt look at me with pity.
For her, it was like, And youre here.
It was the moment I turned from being a victim to a survivor.
She just pointed out I was moving through it.
Some wouldcall it an affair.Yes.
I would talk about it a lot in the press, as you know.
I think its because I was traumatized.
Im looking for help.
Its so fucking obvious to me.
What is the point if we dont expose what needs to be exposed?
I was like, Oh, I dont think were going to go down this road together.
I was like, What do you mean?
What changes would you have to make?
Im like, Ive been to university.
I went to Cambridge.
She went, Yeah, but youre different.
Shes basically reeling off these stereotypes of how to be more convincing as a Black character.
Everything she said, I was like, Nah, I wouldnt do that.
Shes like, Yeah, but youre different.
Youre different.That was Amy Pascal.Thatsnot really a surprise,is it?
Lets face it: I didnt do the movie as a result.
But I just couldnt do it.
Did I feel scared?
Look, no one was ever going to sexually abuse me again.
But I didnt want to be put in a position where I was objectified.
That just didnt feel good.
This is a long time ago anyway, and all those girls are brilliant.
But if that was me now, Id want to disrupt rather than run away.
I think thats probably the change in me.
Thats not the only thing that happened.
Theres the disgusting thing that happenedwith the casting couch.Just this grossness.
Ive got my little black book, which will be published on my deathbed.
Of names?Oh, of everything.
Got to leave something behind, love.
Im not doing it when Im alive.
I dont want to deal with all the fallout and everyone getting their side of the story.
There is no side of the story when youre sexually abused.
You give that up.
Im also a Black girl, and I absolutely [felt like I was] being passed around.
Being Black is important.
This is a little quick flash in the pan.
Well let you come in for a minute.
Its interesting how you two were positioned by the industry.Shes so cool, man.
Im sure she has all her own things.
Quite interesting that we both have one white parent.
Id like to just look at that.
Like on my Instagram, its always my mum.
All my fucking career, I felt like, to Black people, Im not a legitimate Black person.
What I am evidence of is: you’re able to dismiss a Black person.
you could tell whoever the fuck you want, and theyll call it an affair.
Until people start taking this seriously, I cant fully heal.
There are so many problems to feeling disenfranchised.
But I keep finding myself alone.
She might turn out to beThandie Newton winning Emmys.
How do you feel about the movieFlirting?
People sometimes bring up how its an underrated gem.I think its lovely.
Is it complicated for you at all?I havent watched it again.
I dont really want to talk about it.
It doesnt make me feel good to think about it, really.
Just in that moment, my stomach went a bit weird.
It would be so much easier if the film was shit.
Im good, though.
What a shame I wasnt a shit actress.
But it had Nicole [Kidman] in it as well and Naomi Watts.
He would bully me into them.
He would shame me into doing them.
He criticized me for having an opinion.
And I immediately felt like a little girl.
Because, you know, when youre abused, its mental abuse as well.
I just thought I was fucked up; I didnt think that hed fucked me up.
And thats not to say …
I did my best.
I tried to do well.
I wanted to give that character as much intelligence, humanity.
Oh, and then I did another movie that his sister wrote.
But that was fucking gross.
And then there was one particular time where … That was him?Yeah.
And, like, this was supposed to be someone that loved you.
And not just that, personally, as in a relationship, but also youve helped make his career.
Hed be nowhere without me.
Like, of course, you hope people will change, right?
But I realize its not just an individual; its a system.
Thats why I dont particularly like talking about the individual, because it makes that person more special.
Its a whole fucking system of abuse, exploitation.
Thats why watching [JeffreyEpstein: Filthy Rich], I couldnt even get through the first episode.
I was just so undone by that.
Just in terms of grooming, thats the closest to what I experienced.
And its like,Oh my God, its so textbook.
He has his quirks, but I really enjoyed his kind of old-school gentleman director.
I would definitely approach that film in a completely different way now.
I would push for the film to be more about Sally Hemings and Thomas Jefferson.
It wasnt like he was marrying her or even making his children free.
His children would wait on tables and people would be like, Whoa, that looks like Thomas Jefferson.
Whereas when we made the movie, the DNA stuff was still controversial.
Do you know that Sally Hemings was Jeffersons wifes half-sister?
Yes.Her dad was Jeffersons father-in-law.
She wouldve looked a bit like his dead wife.
Her children were his father-in-laws grandchildren, right?
Or his nieces and nephews?
Theyre all fucking related.
I mean, she was his slave.
It was my first big film.
You mean they have or they should?Well, I dont think its paranoia.
Spike Lee and I had a little moment.
Were always respectful when we see each other.
But he wasnt exactly knocking on my door asking me to work with him.
I cant put words in his mouth of what he thought of it.
I know the nature of this business has had me play roles that Im embarrassed I played.
Its had me misrepresent African-Americans.
Because I didnt know.
I have not been of great service in my career.
Ive never cried in an interview before.
WithBeloved, they wanted me to be a lot darker.
Jonathan Demme directed it.
Did you ever talk to Oprah about it?No.
When we were making the movie, we were all, Woo!
I was Beloved to all of them.
They deeply appreciated how far I went.
You came ready and open.
I remember another time it came up really strongly.
I was talking to Chimamanda about it because, again, Im on the paler side.
Chimamanda and I became friends very easily.
Shes from Lagos, Nigeria, and she showed me a picture of her family.
Her siblings ranged from pale like me to darker than Chimamanda.
Nowadays, there is regret for me.
For example, you watchQueen & Slim.I look at Jodie [Turner-Smith].
Or, you look at Lupita [Nyongo].
I do see so clearly why theres been so much deep disappointment.
Did the reaction toBeloveddisappoint you?
It was supposed to be such a major movie, an Oscar contender.We were on the floor.
I was like, Oh God, Im so depressed.
It had had some good reviews, but it hadnt done well at the box office.
And Oprah took to her bed and just ate mac and cheese.
It was hard because we put everything into that movie.
Id love to see it again.
Jonathan was fortunate in that he was working in a time when budgets went into the art.
There were no actors there being paid extortionate figures.
It all ended up on-camera.
I was like, Thats disgusting.
What is the issue?
And Oprah, her response was, Thandie, these things take time.
I wanted to ask you what happened.I wouldnt say it was dodgy.
It was certainly not from Paul Haggiss point of view.
Everything that he did was right on.
The irony is that in the script, it wasnt specific what his hand was doing inside her skirt.
It was just, His hand goes up her skirt, and thats it.
I thought she was being ironic.
Because frankly, if Id been finger-fucked by a cop, I wouldnt even be able to talk.
But wed shot the argument scene already.
And theyre both like looking at their feet.
Im like, I mean, Im just wearing under … yeah.
Because I really want this to be as real as, you know I really want to go there.
Im like, What do you mean?
Because I just want Matt to feel like he can … And I realized what he was saying.
I wasnt even thinking about the [earlier] scene that Id said finger-fuck.
It wasnt until I saw the fucking movie, Im like, Oh, fucking hell!
I went into the makeup trailer and burst into tears.
I was really worried, and I was upset.
There are so many cases, but you dont hear about them.
But thats how much Ive grown.
You could say that Paul Haggis knew a thing or two more than I did.
The movie has been very polarizing since its release.
I dont know if youve readTa-Nehisi Coatess pieceabout it.
He really hated the movie.Maybe thats why he doesnt respond to me on Twitter.
I think hes an extraordinary thinker and writer, and Ive been deeply comforted and changed by his work.
I dont take things personally if someone doesnt like the work Ive done.
I blame the movie.
The movie made him write a shitty piece.
Thats something even at the time I didnt buy into.
Thats for sure.I didnt feel that it was redemptive.
Certainly, not from my characters point of view.
It is weird because I think the movie does have this very deep white liberalism its trying to protect.
I feel like that was just for one joke.
It was literally for that one joke, which is like,Ooh!
Youre going to put that label on these guys for one joke?
The movie was clever and witty, but it basically stopped the judgment.
It neutralized the very real rage that African-American people feel.
Post-Crash,I feel like you should have been in prestige vehicles.
What happened after, in that period up untilWestworld?Ive had a number of breakdowns, I guess.
I remember going to the audition for the new Bond movie, the first one with Daniel Craig.
Id just doneCrash,and yes, I was really hot, and it was my moment.
And I remember going into that audition, and I was so thin and so messed up.
It doesnt have as much to do with the business as you might think.
Its interesting to think of what I did do at that time.
Is that howNorbithappened?Norbitwas in that time, yeah.
The only movie my kids have seen that Im in.
They made me jump through hoops for it, too.
Can you really be funny?
People loveNorbit, though.
Do you?I havent seen it for a very, very long time.
I mean, its so offensive that its not offensive, I guess?
There was just this spate of stuff online.
Eddie found them hilarious.
Thats what the movie was born out of.
When I went to talk about the project, the first draft I read was way darker.
It was about this woman fucking abusing this guy.
Thats why I wanted to do it.
And then it just got very …
I dont know how to describe it … Its like it turned into a kind of Baskin-Robbins commercial.
Eddie was hardly ever there, which was really sad.
He has the best stand-ins youve ever seen.
Literally, from five feet away, you would think they were Eddie.
I think I probably did most of the movie with his stand-ins.
Oh, lets try and think of a good one.
I refused to do a scene where Id have to take my top off.
I was the lead in this new TV show.
And I didnt want to do it.
I was like, It just doesnt make any sense to take it off.
He goes, Listen, kid.
I was actually really grateful for the honesty.
And Im like, Well, listen.
Then definitely fucking not.
But he still got the other actor to pull my top down in the scene.
And thats whats there.
Thats really fucked up.And then we were shooting in Canada.
I guess its hard getting extras, people of color.
It doesnt make any sense.
You cant get more fucking African-American than Oakland.
He said, But we cast you.
So we took care of that.
This is the producer.
That was in the second season.
I thought,I cant do this.
I just cant.We had this sort of sexist, casually racist idiot, you know?
I had an agreement at the beginning of the second season because I was pregnant with my last baby.
I was going to be in my third trimester when I made the show.
He refused to put it in writing but agreed.
And you know what happened.
He had a gentlemans agreement with my agent, and it was all very respectful, apparently.
Obviously, I did get out of it.
I just had to do a few episodes, which wasnt easy.
Everyone hated me for leaving, but no one knew of the agreement a year before.
It was extremely painful.
ThenWestworldwas sent to me.
And if it hadnt been forRogue,I wouldnt have wantedWestworldso much.
But Ill tell you, this was so hideous.
On the last days of doingRogue…
I got killed miserably.
I get dumped in a laundry container by this nasty guy, whos a great actor.
But listen to this: On the side of the garbage-disposal tanks, it says WESTWORLD GARBAGE DISPOSAL.
They all knew I was going to go on to doWestworldbecause Id already signed up to do it.
Thats so petty.Isnt it?
I ended up in the fetal position, weeping, sobbing.
I had put two years of hard work into that show.
And there I was: Westworld Garbage Disposal.
You have so little to go on.
You have the script and you have the director.
Doing something with all the best intentions and then feeling frustrated.
But you felt like the film didnt?Yeah, very much so.
We were making it, he was like, Were going to have this post-credit sequence.
They are all going to be in cages in the Hague.
A mistake that ended up being a good thing.
Or one that made you think.I did a movie with Bertolucci [Besieged,1998].
I was trying to watch it.
I couldnt find it.No shit.
Its kind of beautiful.
But that was supposed to be a one-hour movie made for television, based on a short story.
I wanted to work with Bertolucci.
And it was really great.
Went to Rome for eight weeks.
Shes an African student in Rome, a medical student, very bright.
We went to Kenya to shoot for a week briefly for the dream sequences.
It ended up being a feature, going to festivals, highly praised.
Which youd think is a good thing.
And I was proud, obviously.
The footage from Africa was a big old chunk.
But they never specified where in Africa it was.
It was a generic African country in a state of serious unrest.
And I remember being on a panel in Cannes with Bernardo and the producers.
I was just defending the movie because I was so horrified that it could be perceived that way.
But the truth was I actually agreed with the journalist.
But its not good enough.
And not then either.
The casual ignorance of that is damaging.
Did that surprise you?Nothing surprises me, Alex.
If someones a colleague, you dont want to massively think about what theyre like as a partner.
It certainly wasnt apparent to me.
I didnt feel anything predatory about him.
Heres the other thing: I was only on the movie for a few days.
I certainly didnt know him well.
I was aware of his being a Scientologist, which was surprising to me.
Just any person whos really smart, I find it strange.
Ive worked with Tom Cruise, and he was very generous and open about sharing Scientological stuff.
Christmas gifts would be something to do with Scientology.
What was your experience like onMission: Impossible 2?
And why didnt you do another one?Oh, I was never asked.
I was so scared of Tom.
He was a very dominant individual.
He tries superhard to be a nice person.
He takes on a lot.
And I dont think it was a very well-written scene.
I get angry with him.
Were frustrated with each other.
And were looking out over Spain.
It wasnt going well.
And John Woo, bless him, wasnt there.
He was downstairs looking at everything on a monitor.
Which I think was very helpful to him, but it was extremely unhelpful to the rest of us.
Lets just rehearse on-camera.
So we rehearsed and they recorded it, and then he goes, Ill be you.
And it was the most unhelpful …
I cant think of anything less revealing.
It just pushed me further into a place of terror and insecurity.
It was a real shame.
And I really do mean bless him, because he was trying his damnedest.
It would take anyone else 48 hours to manifest a zit.
I saw it growing, and it was like the zit was me, just getting bigger and bigger.
I remember calling Jonathan Demme.
I described the night to him: A nightmare.
As I was describing it, it was clear that I thought I was the big fucking problem.
And Jonathan was like, Thandie, shame on you for not backing yourself.
He was really sweet.
And then Tom called and I thought,Oh, this is it.
The apology.No, he was just like, Were going to reshoot this next week.
Im like, Way brilliant.
He just wanted this alpha bitch.
And I did as best as I could.
Its not the best way to get the best work out of someone.
It was just he was really stressed.
I had the most extraordinary time, and you know who got me that role?
You know what I mean?
Its kind of nice if you’re free to pick together.
Nicole was a huge advocate for me.
Look, creative stuff is difficult.
I was so tender and sensitive.
Id had good therapy.
Id realized that I was precious.
If it was me now, I would want to go in and go, Hey!
You wouldnt need to play me and I play you on that balcony.
And I would have squeezed that spot.
